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sonofachipwich's review against another edition
This book both completely changed my perspective on colonial-era transatlantic movement of people and ideas, and also left me wanting a lot more information. Sadly, I figure it is so sparse because it took so much work just to draw out what is presented here from the historical record. Incredible archival work on display here to give us the barest glimpse of the indigenous American experience of Europe.
totallytrucked's review against another edition
5.0
one of those books that i'm going to be recommending to everyone. a really great postscript to the class i took on mesoamerica. the author is extremely smart and respectful. dr ebert read this
themascarasnake's review against another edition
challenging
dark
emotional
informative
sad
medium-paced
5.0
This was a 4-star book for me up until the last passages dealing with the trio of Inuit people taken from their home and paraded around Bristol and London. Their story is so heartbreaking and it was written so carefully and emotively that I really felt it cemented what this book is really about. It's packed with fascinating and often awful tales of cultural transmission, but it's clear the author cares about what they're writing about and how they are expressing it.
arih's review against another edition
challenging
dark
emotional
informative
reflective
sad
slow-paced
3.5
catherine_the_greatest's review against another edition
3.0
When we realise that there were thousands of Indigenous people in Europe from as early as the 1490s, it becomes impossible to dismiss them as insignificant oddities. Across Spain and Portugal, France, Italy, England, and the Low Countries, Europeans were meeting Indigenous people, as diplomats, performers, translators, sailors, servants, family members, and enslaved people. A majority were involuntary migrants -- kidnapped or coerced from their homes -- but there were also a significant number of free people, travelling individually or in small groups. Most went to Spain and Portugal rather than England, the Tudors being busy with their domestic issues and giving little time to overseas exploration until Elizabeth I's disastrous Roanoke venture in the 1580s. But even England had several high-profile Native visitors, including Manteo and Wanchese, the Coastal Algonquin men who -- as we'll see -- became a critical part of early imperial enterprises, translating for Walter Ralegh and helping to compose an orthography for the Ossomocomuck Angonquian language in London. These men's explicit role as go-betweens, helping to translate the novelties of the 'New World' and inform European views of the Americas, is obvious, but a similar role was being played by Indigenous people at every level of European society, from the enslaved to the nobility.
Caroline Dodds Pennock, a British historian who specializes in Aztec history, took on an ambitious project: searching the historic record (and drawing on other historians' work) for people from the Americas who went to Europe (for both brief and extended periods) during the first century or two of globalization. The documents that have survived include very little actual narration (or extremely biased narration), so often she (and others who came before her) must rely on court documents (including appeals to the European courts to right the wrongs perpetrated by conquistadors and other Europeans), financial records (such as expenses approved to clothe, house, and otherwise support foreign royalty and others out of the crown's coffers), and other vague references to visitors from the Western Hemisphere. A certain amount of speculation is necessary to put the pieces together, but at times it feels like entire pages are constructed out of Ms. Pennock's conjectures about what people might have experienced and how they might have perceived European culture based on the differences from their own cultures.
Overall, a fairly interesting study, taking a different perspective on history, but less speculation could have made it a stronger (and shorter) read.
Caroline Dodds Pennock, a British historian who specializes in Aztec history, took on an ambitious project: searching the historic record (and drawing on other historians' work) for people from the Americas who went to Europe (for both brief and extended periods) during the first century or two of globalization. The documents that have survived include very little actual narration (or extremely biased narration), so often she (and others who came before her) must rely on court documents (including appeals to the European courts to right the wrongs perpetrated by conquistadors and other Europeans), financial records (such as expenses approved to clothe, house, and otherwise support foreign royalty and others out of the crown's coffers), and other vague references to visitors from the Western Hemisphere. A certain amount of speculation is necessary to put the pieces together, but at times it feels like entire pages are constructed out of Ms. Pennock's conjectures about what people might have experienced and how they might have perceived European culture based on the differences from their own cultures.
Overall, a fairly interesting study, taking a different perspective on history, but less speculation could have made it a stronger (and shorter) read.
coffeedog14's review against another edition
adventurous
dark
emotional
informative
inspiring
mysterious
sad
fast-paced
4.0
This book had a lot less weird anecdotes then I was expecting, and a lot more... *people*. Like, credit where it's due, I had no idea just how *many* people over such a long length of time made their way from Native societies to European ones, and in how many different forms that took. There are centuries worth of tens to hundreds of thousands of people, often but not always in bondage, making their way to Europe and making an impact. If there is less scholarship about this then about similar experiences with the African Diaspora, it seems to be because so many of the Natives just fucking died, or were actively erased from the record.
This is a book filled with stories of all sorts, frequently unhappy, but all unique and important.
This is a book filled with stories of all sorts, frequently unhappy, but all unique and important.
notesofatimetraveller's review against another edition
5.0
When thinking about the early years of exploration, we may think of, or been taught, about explorers such as Hernan Cortes, Christopher Columbus, Ferdinand Magellan or Walter Raleigh. These individuals left behind evidence of their travels, such as Columbus' Journal, Cortes' letters, or the selected writings of Raleigh. But, what impact did this exploration, colonisation and conquest have on the Native peoples of the Americas? And, what about the early Indigenous people who travelled to Europe? On Savage Shores - How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe by Dr Caroline Dodds Pennock takes a deep dive into the sources to piece together the lives of Indigenous people during this time.
I first heard about Dr Dodds Pennock's work while listening to Episode 175 of the Talking Tudors podcast focusing on The Lives of Aztec-Mexica Women. Then more recently, I listened to an episode of Not Just the Tudors, in which Dr Dodds Pennock was interviewed about How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe. While I generally focus on English history, I have been making an effort to read more widely. Additionally, while this book focuses on Indigenous Americans, it hones in on the sixteenth century, which is an area that I am particularly interested in. I must admit, when reading English history books, I often find myself wondering what is going on in the rest of the world at this time. This book certainly opened my eyes to some of it.
As Dr Dodds Pennock identifies in the Introduction:
"For the Indigenous travelers in my work, Europe was the 'savage shore'; a land of incomprehensible inequality and poverty that defied pre-invasion values and logics, where resources were hoarded, children ruled great kingdoms, and common people were meant meekly to accept injustices without dissent."
This really set the scene and tone of the book. From reading the introduction, I was hooked and needed to know more. On Savage Shores is well written and impeccably researched. While there are many unfamiliar names and terms, which can be challenging to remember, the comprehensive glossary aids with this hurdle. Dr Dodds Pennock draws from a wide range of sources - including those more familiar primary sources from the well-known explorers, to brief glimpses of Indigenous peoples who appear in Ambassadorial accounts, letters and court records.
Throughout this brilliant, yet sensitive book, readers will learn about the initial relationships between explorers and Indigenous peoples, slavery, Indigenous diplomacy, and the many lives that were lost. There was a lot of information that both shocked and saddened me. I learnt a great deal from this book and it is certainly one that I will purchasing to add to my collection of history books. I highly recommend reading On Savage Shores: How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe by Dr Caroline Dodds Pennock.
A huge thank you to NetGalley and Knopf Publishing for early access to this book. On Savage Shores: How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe by Dr Caroline Dodds Pannock is due for publication in the 24th of January, 2023.
I first heard about Dr Dodds Pennock's work while listening to Episode 175 of the Talking Tudors podcast focusing on The Lives of Aztec-Mexica Women. Then more recently, I listened to an episode of Not Just the Tudors, in which Dr Dodds Pennock was interviewed about How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe. While I generally focus on English history, I have been making an effort to read more widely. Additionally, while this book focuses on Indigenous Americans, it hones in on the sixteenth century, which is an area that I am particularly interested in. I must admit, when reading English history books, I often find myself wondering what is going on in the rest of the world at this time. This book certainly opened my eyes to some of it.
As Dr Dodds Pennock identifies in the Introduction:
"For the Indigenous travelers in my work, Europe was the 'savage shore'; a land of incomprehensible inequality and poverty that defied pre-invasion values and logics, where resources were hoarded, children ruled great kingdoms, and common people were meant meekly to accept injustices without dissent."
This really set the scene and tone of the book. From reading the introduction, I was hooked and needed to know more. On Savage Shores is well written and impeccably researched. While there are many unfamiliar names and terms, which can be challenging to remember, the comprehensive glossary aids with this hurdle. Dr Dodds Pennock draws from a wide range of sources - including those more familiar primary sources from the well-known explorers, to brief glimpses of Indigenous peoples who appear in Ambassadorial accounts, letters and court records.
Throughout this brilliant, yet sensitive book, readers will learn about the initial relationships between explorers and Indigenous peoples, slavery, Indigenous diplomacy, and the many lives that were lost. There was a lot of information that both shocked and saddened me. I learnt a great deal from this book and it is certainly one that I will purchasing to add to my collection of history books. I highly recommend reading On Savage Shores: How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe by Dr Caroline Dodds Pennock.
A huge thank you to NetGalley and Knopf Publishing for early access to this book. On Savage Shores: How Indigenous Americans Discovered Europe by Dr Caroline Dodds Pannock is due for publication in the 24th of January, 2023.